Author Topic: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!  (Read 952 times)

Online Daniel Grant

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Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« on: August 03, 2017, 01:16:34 AM »
My main garden which is 3/4 acre has been a serious struggle to try to control the grass and pigweed. The grass grows like a pasture. I cultivate and till between the rows but with all the rain I have  had, it is hard to get ahead of it. The hardest place to control it is within the rows between the plants. I have been considering a one time application of a herbicide to get it under control and to try to stay ahead of it. My question is have any of you used a herbicide? If so which one and did it help? Any suggestions on grass and pigweed control? Whiskydog referred to it as a goat patch. If that gives you an idea of the problem.
Kubota 7100, L210, Allis G, TroyBilt, Horse, Gravely, Dr. Bush mower, Tuff Bilt tractor

Offline Double B

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2017, 06:32:54 AM »
Daniel,

I have never used a herbicide in or around my garden. I have a neighbor across the road that uses it in between his rows and around the border of his garden. In rainy years, I think we all have the same problem you have but I try and control mine with cultivation.

What kind of grass do you have in your garden? If it is Bermuda, tilling or cultivating will spread it. You can always use a weed burner. The main thing on the grass and weeds is to get to them before they go to seed. Once they do, it makes it very difficult to control. My big garden in the back (approx an acre), I use Donald's plant a row and skip a row method. This allows me to till right next to the crops and makes for a prettier garden.

Last but not least, there is always plastic mulch and drip tape. Please do not think that I am being judgemental on the herbicide. It is just not for me but most of the food that is bought in stores these days and nearly all the processed foods people consume have herbicide crops in them. I will be curious to see how others weigh in on this topic.
14.08 acres, John Deere 5055E, Stevens Row Hippers and cultivator, 8' Bush Hog, 74" Frontier Tiller, John Deere 655Z

Online Rabbitproof

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2017, 07:49:12 AM »
All good suggestions from Double B----cannot add anything, except to hire some folks to get in there and weed!!

Offline Double B

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2017, 08:11:37 AM »
Daniel,

One other "natural" suggestion I will add is in the off season coming up soon, you may want to run you some strands of electrical fence around that garden and put a couple of pigs in there. They will eliminate everything from nut sedge to grass and drop you some fertilizer in there for free. Next spring you can sell or butcher the hogs. I have been planning on doing this in my back garden but like many of my other projects, I have not made it a priority. When I was young, I raised hogs and would turn them out in the garden and you cannot imagine how clean it will be for years to come.

All my best,
Double B
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Online Monroe

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2017, 09:13:05 AM »
Dan I understand the cons of using a herbicide, but I do use roundup. Over spray would be of concern but I take all necessary precautions to prevent this. My main weed & grass control is done by using the tiller.

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Offline Texan

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2017, 09:47:25 AM »
I want to share my pig experience. My pasture is bermuda, so perrenial rhyzome grass. I had pigs on it in a single place for 18 months. The final 12 months there were 20 of them. No nose rings to prevent rooting. 30 days after pigs were removed, the bermuda started to peak out from what was bare soil. The roots were there just waiting to grow.

It is my opinion that you can weed, or till, or release pigs, or spray vinegar, or any other all natural organic remedy, and you will have plenty of time to try them all because every season it will regrow to let you try again.

Online Rabbitproof

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2017, 09:56:45 AM »
Bermuda is called Devil Grass----for a good reason. However, I like the tiff green they use on golf course greens----had a beautiful yard of it in Ms.

Offline Double B

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2017, 10:54:09 AM »
I have common Bermuda too and I spray Roundup down the sides of my gravel driveway. The herbicide will literally smoke it for a couple of months and then it comes back greener than ever. Looks like it has been spray painted green when it returns. I guess there is just no getting rid of it.
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Online whiskydog

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2017, 11:01:03 AM »
In the hot dry days of August if you will break bermuda up and turn it every third day it will die..

at least thats how I get rid of it..


an old farmer told me that back in the 60s when I was helping him on his farm.
If I'm not having problems,, I'm not doing it right..

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Offline thebayougardener

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2017, 12:34:47 PM »
If it’s as bad as I imagine your best bet is to use your tiller as soon as the plants are finished producing.  Spraying RoundUp would take care of what’s there now but you’ll still have weed seed in the soil.  Each time you move that soil around you’ll have more to come up, which is the case with most gardens.  A second or third pass with the tiller as those seeds come up would put a dent in the problem.

Donald
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Online Daniel Grant

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2017, 06:44:06 PM »
I would like to thank everyone for their ideas and suggestions. I have never used a herbicide before and was wanting to avoid it if I could which is why I posted my problem. This is going to be my current solution:
Till the garden with the rear flap up on the tiller which tends to leave the vegetation on the top rather than burying it which in fact is replanting it. The sun usually will kill what is on the top in a couple of days. I plan on planting with my Cole 12 MX planter because I will be able to have a much straighter row. I can also incorporate fertilizer as I plant. I plan to use a pair of KULT weeder/Kress finger weeders with maybe a basket weeder on the outside of these. This will give me a mechanical cultivator approach that will help me better control the weeds between the plants as well as the weeds on each side of the row. I will fabricate this for my Tuff Bilt tractor to fit under the belly so I can keep an eye on the cultivation and that way I can tell if I am removing plants. I also have a hand propane flamer that I can use if the vegetable plants are spaced enough not to fry them.

Texan and the rest of you were correct in that within a week of tilling (with Troybilt Horse) or cultivating between rows the weeds returned  and were invigorated with new growth. This year I had several stretches of a week or more where it rained everyday and I could not get into the garden. You all know once the grass and pigweed gets ahead of you it is very difficult to get it back under control. Thanks again for your suggestions.
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Offline Bennefim

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2017, 10:56:20 AM »
Daniel, another suggestion would be to plant cover crops during the off season to keep the ground covered. Bare soil seems to collect all types of seeds. I've had the same weed problems and cover crops have certainly helped. Good luck!

Doug
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Offline Bcorley

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2017, 01:54:53 PM »
I have red root pigweed.  My place was leased to cattle farmers for 40 years.  They had to control costs so they fed CHEAP hay.  I have glyphosate tolerant red root pigweed.  In other words, THE WEED FROM HELL.  They will grow nearly shoulder high and they are COVERED with seeds.  The only thing I have tried that knocks a dent in them is Galigan 2E in a cocktail with roundup (4 to 1) and mixed with water according to galigan instructions.  I prepare new ground and row up, then I apply and let sit for a day or so, then plant with a Covington.  The opening shovel makes a swath about 6 inches wide and that allows the desired seed to germinate.  Eventually the pigweed will punch through in the row middles (everywhere the crust is broken) and I use a rolling cultivator for that.  AFTER YOU SPRAY AND IT DRIES, EVERYWHERE YOU BREAK THE CRUST YOU WILL GET PIGWEED. I have had some success spot spraying from the 'unit' everywhere I seed 'little piggies' showing their heads.  Eventually I just start running the Lilliston on the rows themselves and the Mohawk in the row middles. Good luck.   

Offline JetCat

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2017, 01:44:23 PM »
i can understand anyone not wanting to use a herbicide but with a garden of significant size it's next to impossible to keep it weed free otherwise.

i commercial farmed for the better part of 40 yrs and now just hobby farm more or less, i still use Trifluralin (Treflan) for a per-emergant (not if you plan to grow corn the following year in that spot tho) and clethodim (Arrow) as a post emergent, both are labeled for use in crops and are very safe when used as labeled.

Treflan works great against redroot pig weed as well as many broad leaf weeds that plague a garden.  Arrow will kill Bermuda grass (and other grasses) and not harm your crops.  both are much better choices for the garden then glyphosate (roundup).


Offline Double B

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2017, 04:58:44 PM »
Welcome to the forum JetCat. We look forward to hearing more about your farming and gardening experiences.
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Offline JetCat

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2017, 05:28:56 PM »
Thank you.

Online Daniel Grant

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #16 on: August 06, 2017, 12:04:06 AM »
JetCat,
 I want to welcome you to the forum and I look forward to  reading your posts. I appreciate your post. I have a serious problem with Bermuda grass that grows so thick in a very short time it is like a mat. I think at one time years ago my garden area must have been a pasture. I can cultivate between the rows but in the row it will quickly choke out the seeded plants. I read up on Clethodim/arrow and it might help me control the grass. I do not think some of the other members have experienced being over run by grass to the point you have to terminate the crop. Thanks again for your suggestion and I look forward to hearing more about your experiences with farming and gardening.
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Offline Davidx357

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #17 on: August 06, 2017, 12:45:27 AM »
Daniel
I like, everyone else with a fair size garden, work on this problem.  Two things I do that really help is I use  a pump up sprayer with glyphosate and  keep the pressure real low so that it just drips and I drip it on the plant I want to get rid of.  The other thing I do when it gets out of hand is use a bucket of glyphosate and a 4" paint roller and roll the the area.   Any type spray in the garden of glyphosate is not good because of the drift and volatility.

You should do a year round program to control weeds.  In the end of July, after a soil sample, I take everything out my  garden and  and do the recommendations and water to germinate the weed seeds and then kill them.   MY timing may different than yours but the principal is the same.  This also good for killing grubs that eat potatoes.

Also never let any weed go to seed.  Again never let any weed go to seed.  At anytime.

Hope this helps. 

David

Online Monroe

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #18 on: August 06, 2017, 07:51:51 AM »
I remember an old saying that was something like this, if you want some good Bermuda grass, plant cotton. Gardening is about the same way. The garden spot I show is a little piece from about an acre or more I did when much younger. Over the years I've done everything for grass & weed control except use dynamite. Bermuda and weeds have taken over the okra in the picture, but the okra is still winning. This has been one of my best tomato years. The other day I mowed where the PHPs had been along with the weeds then tilled. My best success stories in the last few years has been from listening and watching Donald.

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Offline hunter4559

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Re: Grass and Pigweed Control - Help!
« Reply #19 on: August 06, 2017, 10:23:04 AM »
I too use roundup in a pump sprayer to do spot control of weeds. They also make a wick applicator that can be used. I also use a pre-emergent containing Treflan. It works quite well. Mulching works well but for a garden the size of yours you would need truck loads of it.
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